ISO/TC145-IEC/SC3C JWG 11 N 141

Transcription

1 ISO/TC145-IEC/SC3C JWG 11 N 141 ISO ORGANISATION INTERNATIONALE DE NORMALISATION INTERNATIONAL ORGANIZATION FOR STANDARDIZATION IEC COMMISSION ÉLECTROTECHNIQUE INTERNATIONALE INTERNATIONAL ELECTROTECHNICAL COMMISSION Title: Combin compilation s on IEC/2CDV Edition 2.0 Source: Convener / Project Leader Status: To be discuss by ISO/IEC JWG 11 Date: Document 2CDV on Project IEC Ed. 2.0 was distribut among ISO and IEC members, votes on which were clos on All receiv comments were compil as attach. Comments of two-letter national codes with were observ by Secretariat of IEC/TC 3/SC 3C; and ones with were observ by Project Leader as proposal for discussion. Among other comments, the proposal identifi by the code US-7 was highlight for discussion and recommendation by JWG 11. All members of ISO/TC 145/SC 3 IEC/TC 3/SC 3C JWG 11 were kindly ask to review the attachment so that any different views were rais. This document was open for discussion until After this date, Project Leader / Convener would be in charge to revise 2CDV to be consider as an FDIS.

2 Annex Date Document Project Nr XX 3C/1569A/CDV IEC Ed.2 National JP US-1 US-2 1 Avantpropos Foreword 2 nd paragraph after e d items General COMMENTS Propos change OBSERVATIONS OF THE SECRETARIAT on each comment submitt JP NC supports the document with no comment. Remplacer le terme «épaisseur de trait» par «largeur de trait» pour assurer la cohérence dans le vocabulaire utilisé dans les normes concernées et aussi avec le terme anglais «line width». explicatif mais non pris en compte dans le 2e DIS (F). The sponsoring ISO committee for JWG 11 is now TC 145/SC 3, not TC 145. Item b) Item e) recognizes that the revision allows some freom in the use of the basic pattern. Item b) does not acknowlge that some freom is given for line widths for consistency with already standardiz graphical symbols which are cover by technical regulations. Paragrap Foreword Introduction Introduction Paragraph 1 The first sentence states that A graphical symbol is defin as but the wording omits the critical phrase with a particular meaning. The first sentence states that A graphical symbol is defin as but the wording omits the critical phrase with a particular meaning. This International Standard has been prepar in co-operation with ISO/TC 145/SC 3. Revise item b): b) Mandatory requirement for the line width of symbol originals is chang to 2 mm or 4 mm. Some freom is given for line width such as for a symbol to be consistent with already standardiz graphical symbols in ISO 7000 or IEC which are cover by technical regulations. Change visually perceptible figure to visually perceptible figure with a particular meaning to bring the wording into line with the definition in clause 3.4. Change visually perceptible figure to visually perceptible figure with a particular meaning to bring the wording into line with the definition in clause 3.4. Not. The term "épaisseur de trait" was us as the French translation of "line width" in the 1st ition of IEC However, the NC is not oppos to using "largeur de trait" instead. Therefore, the proposal was accept. The items highlighting technical changes from the previous ition (Ed.1.0) under Foreword had been formulat as simple as possible. Propos 2 nd sentence to be add relat to the 6 th paragraph under 7.3, which is applicable in exceptional cases. In order to avoid any confusion caus by the propos different wording, a reference would only be given such as See 6 th paragraph,

3 2 1 Introduction 1 3 alinéa - 3e tiret COMMENTS Propos change OBSERVATIONS OF THE SECRETARIAT on each comment submitt 3e alinéa Remplacer le terme «épaisseur de trait» par «largeur de trait» pour assurer la cohérence dans le vocabulaire utilisé dans les normes concernées et aussi avec le terme anglais «line width». explicatif mais non pris en compte dans le 2e DIS (F). Remplacer le terme «documentation technique des produits» par «documentation technique de produits» pour assurer la cohérence dans le vocabulaire avec les normes de l ISO/TC 10 explicatif mais non pris en compte dans le 2e DIS (F). Voir titre des normes ISO citées en bibliographie. The term "épaisseur de trait" was us as the French translation of "line width" in the 1st ition of IEC However, the NC is not oppos to using "largeur de trait" instead. Therefore, the propos change was accept. Accept in consultation with NC.. 2 Paragraph 1 There are no dat references. Delete the second sentence. 2 Paragraph There are no dat references. Delete the second sentence. 1 3 or 5 General The document addresses important Please define negation and prohibition, These terms had intentionally been issues dealing with "negation" and - negation, for instance in relation to the defin, because the term prohibition "prohibition" : function of a device, had been defin in ISO It is Both terms should be defin in clause 3 - prohibition, for instance in relation to represent by a circle combin with a or 5. the behaviour of the user. diagonal bar to prohibit an action relat to safety. 2 3 Editorial The definitions should be introduc in a logical order, and not list alphabetically. Logical order propos: 3.1 graphical symbol 3.2 symbol original 3.3 description 3.4 graphical symbol element 3.5 title 3.6 basic pattern 3.7 nominal size 3.8 graphical symbol for registration 3.9 equipment See also the observation on 6 on paragrap. Not accept because once it was agre to list alphabetical order. 3

4 3 3 4 DE-1 DE COMMENTS Propos change OBSERVATIONS OF THE SECRETARIAT on each comment submitt 3.1 Remplacer le terme «épaisseur de trait» par «largeur de trait» pour assurer la cohérence dans le vocabulaire utilisé dans les normes concernées et aussi avec le terme anglais «line width». explicatif mais non pris en compte dans le 2e DIS (F). 3.1 Editorial In definition 3.1, the expression "most significant part" is ambiguous. 3.5 Paragrap 3.5 Paragrap 4 a) Paragrap 4 a) Paragrap Parts of a symbol original should only be referr to as graphical symbol elements when they are us in more than one graphical symbol. Parts of a symbol original should only be referr to as graphical symbol elements when they are us in more than one graphical symbol. The wording clear definition of the graphical symbol sound as if a general definition is being provid whereas the specific purpose is being defin. The wording clear definition of the graphical symbol sound as if a general definition is being provid whereas the specific purpose is being defin. Please clarify. Amend definition to Part of a graphical symbol which is us with a particular meaning in more than one graphical symbol Amend definition to Part of a graphical symbol which is us with a particular meaning in more than one graphical symbol Replace develop a clear definition of the graphical symbol with define clearly the purpose of the graphical symbol. Replace develop a clear definition of the graphical symbol with define clearly the purpose of the graphical symbol. 4 e) Remplacer partout dans le texte de la présente norme le terme «intelligibilité» par «compréhensibilité» pour assurer une certaine cohérence entre les documents normatifs internationaux er alinéa 1ère ligne Modifier comme suit : «normalement utilisés avec» 7.1 E plural s missing... taking into account the requirements given in clause E plural s missing... taking into account the requirements given in clause 8. The term "épaisseur de trait" was us as the French translation of "line width" in the 1st ition of IEC However, the NC is not oppos to using "largeur de trait" instead. Therefore, the propos change was accept. Not, but no actual proposal was provid. Accept in general. The term purpose would be purpose and meaning. Ditto Accept in consultation with NC.. Accept in consultation with NC.. 4

5 US-1 US-4 US-5 US-6 US COMMENTS Propos change OBSERVATIONS OF THE SECRETARIAT on each comment submitt 7.1 Figure 3 The second line of the Note to Figure 3 is Revise to move second line of the Note Note indent. flush left. It should be flush left. See the Notes in the ISO/IEC Directives. 7.2 NOTE «ou lorsque la distance à laquelle le symbole est vu est importante.» 7.2 Notes The second and third lines of the Notes to clause 7.2 are indent; they should be flush left. See the Notes in the ISO/IEC Directives rd paragrap h th paragrap h th paragrap h te The verb "might be" is not found in the ISO/IEC Directives. Use "may" to indicate permission. Use "can" to indicate possibility. Use only the main verb if expression of neither permission nor possibility is necessary. In this case, only the main verb is ne. The verb "might be" is not found in the ISO/IEC Directives. Use "may" to indicate permission. Use "can" to indicate possibility. Use only the main verb if expression of neither permission nor possibility is necessary. In this case, only the main verb is ne. As written, the sentence implies that a combination of line widths may be us only when both conditions apply: to emphasize parts of the graphical symbol AND to increase visual clarity. In reality, this is an OR relationship: either reason is sufficient to justify a combination of line widths. explicatif mais non pris en compte dans le 2e DIS (F). Revise to move second and third lines of the Notes flush left. Reasons for choosing 2 mm include. Reasons for choosing 2 mm include. A combination of both line widths symbol or to increase visual clarity. Accept in consultation with NC.. JWG 11 would be ask to observe the proposal. 5

6 US-8 US US Title te Letters, s, punctuation marks, and mathematical symbols are properly referr to as "symbol elements", not "symbols", in the context of symbol originals. This is indicat by the opening prepositional phrase of 7.8: "For constituent elements of symbol originals." 7.8 te It is important to point out that the fonts shown in a symbol original are not restrictive in practice. The important point is legibility of fonts, not precisely which font is us. 7.9 NOTE The note appears to relate only to subclause whereas it applies more generally to clause NOTE The note appears to relate only to subclause whereas it applies more generally to clause Paragrap Paragrap COMMENTS Propos change OBSERVATIONS OF THE SECRETARIAT on each comment submitt The circle with the diagonal bar is not necessarily a concept for the reader of this standard. The use of the definite article is therefore inappropriate. The circle with the diagonal bar is not necessarily a concept for the reader of this standard. The use of the definite article is therefore inappropriate Note The second line of the Note to clause is indent; it should be flush left. See the Notes in the ISO/IEC Directives. Revise title: Characters as symbol elements Add note: NOTE The font shown in a symbol original is not restrictive; other fonts may be us provid legibility is maintain. As there is no general text under 7.9, the note should be mov to the bottom of clause which is the most general subclause. As there is no general text under 7.9, the note should be mov to the bottom of clause which is the most general subclause. Change text to A circle combin with a diagonal bar is defin in ISO for use in safety applications to denote a prohibition. Therefore, a circle combin with a diagonal bar, in any colour including black and white, shall not be us for the negation of graphical symbols for use on equipment. Change text to A circle combin with a diagonal bar is defin in ISO for use in safety applications to denote a prohibition. Therefore, a circle combin with a diagonal bar, in any colour including black and white, shall not be us for the negation of graphical symbols for use on equipment. Revise to move second line of the Note flush left. See also 5 and. 6

7 4 US US Clause/ Subclause Paragraph Figure/ COMMENTS Propos change OBSERVATIONS OF THE SECRETARIAT on each comment submitt 8 Editorial Clause 8 deals with "basic pattern", but Give the definition of "basic pattern" in there is no definition of this term. Clause 3 See also 2. 8 Lire : Accept in colsultation with NC.. «et les rectangles sur les rectangles 5 et 6» explicatif mais non pris en compte dans le 2e DIS (F) nd sentence 8.2 b) Paragrap 8.2 b) Paragrap The word "between" is us when two entities are involv. When three or more entities are involv, the word "among" is correct. In this case, more than two graphical symbols are involv. It is unclear what the word those refers to. It is unclear what the word those refers to. It is us impression among the graphical symbols. Replace are consistent with those in IEC and ISO 7000 with are consistent with relat symbols in IEC and ISO Replace are consistent with those in IEC and ISO 7000 with are consistent with relat symbols in IEC and ISO c) Lire : «et les rectangles sur les rectangles 5 et 6» Commentaire accepté dans le rapport explicatif mais non pris en compte dans le 2e DIS (F). 8.3 Paragrap 8.3 Paragrap nd paragara ph The meaning would be simpler and clearer with minor changes to the wording and punctuation. The meaning would be simpler and clearer with minor changes to the wording and punctuation. The text is slightly ambiguous regarding the relationship of the vertical and horizontal lines that form the corner markings. Change text to Each of the corner markings consists of a vertical and a horizontal line, each of 6 mm. Change text to Each of the corner markings consists of a vertical and a horizontal line, each of 6 mm. Each of the corner markings consists of a vertical line and a horizontal line, each of 6.0 mm length, which are join to delineate one corner of the basic pattern. Accept in consultation with NC.. It is a detail version of the above. 7

8 US-13 US-14 DE-2 DE-2 DE-3 DE-3 DE-4 DE Figure 8 Note 8.3 Figure 8 Note COMMENTS Propos change OBSERVATIONS OF THE SECRETARIAT on each comment submitt The second line of the Note to Figure 8 is indent. It should be flush left. See the Notes in the ISO/IEC Directives. Notes to figures should be plac above the figure and title. See the ISO/IEC Directives, clause Revise to move second line of the Note flush left. Revise to move Note above the figure and title. A.1 1 st para E delete comma, add be for more clarity It shall be unique, i.e. not be the same as those... A.1 1 st para E delete comma, add be for more clarity It shall be unique, i.e. not be the same as those... A.2 last para, E example s A.2 last para, example s A.2 last para, example s A.2 last para, example s E E E The last example The meaning of this graphical symbol depends on its orientation... is a statement of fact, has no normative character. The last example The meaning of this graphical symbol depends on its orientation... is a statement of fact, has no normative character. In the IEC database, the Phrase The meaning of this graphical symbol depends on its orientation can be found in slightly different versions: this symbol this graphical symbol this symbol the symbol on its orientation upon its orientation In the IEC database, the Phrase The meaning of this graphical symbol depends on its orientation can be found in slightly different versions: Move example to A.3 Notes, 1 st paragraph. Instead add: Symbol shall be us in the orientation shown. Move example to A.3 Notes, 1 st paragraph. Instead add: Symbol shall be us in the orientation shown. JWG 11 should decide for one of these versions and use it here. JWG 11 should decide for one of these versions and use it here. The comment is on IEC and not on IEC/CDV Ed.2. JWG 11 will be ask to discuss the comment as a separate issue. this symbol this graphical symbol this symbol the symbol on its orientation upon its orientation 8

9 (ISO DE-5 DE-5 A.2 Paragrap A.2 Paragrap B.1 Paragrap B.1 Paragrap COMMENTS Propos change OBSERVATIONS OF THE SECRETARIAT on each comment submitt The word specifics, the meaning of short and the requirements for nonspecialist users are not sufficiently clear. The word specifics, the meaning of short and the requirements for nonspecialist users are not sufficiently clear. The wording of the last sentence of this paragraph could be improv. The wording of the last sentence of this paragraph could be improv. B.1 NOTE The wording of the note could be improv. B.1 NOTE The wording of the note could be improv. B.2 a) E Use definitive article to be in line with recommendation in B.1 B.2 a) E Use definitive article to be in line with recommendation in B.1 Change text to The description shall provide enough detail to understand the intend use of the graphical symbol and provide any essential specific information relevant to its meaning or use. In the case of graphical symbols intend for specialist users, non-specialist users should at least be able to identify the product area. Change text to The description shall provide enough detail to understand the intend use of the graphical symbol and provide any essential specific information relevant to its meaning or use. In the case of graphical symbols intend for specialist users, non-specialist users should at least be able to identify the product area. Change text to Where this is not the case, more explanation will be necessary about: Change text to Where this is not the case, more explanation will be necessary about: Replace can be found at both the ISO TC 145/SC3 and the IEC TC 3/SC 3C web sites with can be found on both the ISO TC 145/SC3 and the IEC TC 3/SC 3C websites. Replace can be found at both the ISO TC 145/SC3 and the IEC TC 3/SC 3C web sites with can be found on both the ISO TC 145/SC3 and the IEC TC 3/SC 3C websites. Change example into: To identify the brake. Change example into: To identify the brake. 9

10 DE-6 DE-6 US COMMENTS Propos change OBSERVATIONS OF THE SECRETARIAT on each comment submitt B.2 m) E See comment DE-3 Delete the example: The meaning of this symbol depends upon its orientation. Replace by: Symbol shall be us in the orientation shown B.2 m) E See comment DE-3 Delete the example: The meaning of this symbol depends upon its orientation. Replace by: Symbol shall be us in the orientation shown C.1 Example The text in the examples uses type size that is larger than the text in the examples in C.2.1 and C.2.2. The text is also indent and spac differently from the text in the examples in C.2.1 and C.2.2. Revise to be consistent in font size, indentation, and spacing with the examples in C.2.1 and C.2.2. FORM COMMENTS